Sometimes a conversation comes along at just the right moment to create maximum impact on everything that follows. Sometimes a conversation simultaneously affirms and challenges beliefs, definitions, and worldviews. This conversation is certainly one of those.
As leaders, David Gold wants us to consider deeply our philosophy of leadership as well as the fears holding us back from fully sharing our gifts. He wants us to extend our dreams to their limit and discover what can be created just beyond. He asks us to consider our Hero’s Journey and to overwrite the personal narratives that limit our full potential. David shares keys to enlightened decision making for every leader seeking to take the next step in their development, which include:
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Is this mine to do or is it an obligation?
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How does this decision make me feel?
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What is the best, most loving decision to make at this moment?
What in your life has prepared you for your purpose? This conversation, the habits and methods David shares with listeners, is part of your preparation to become the fully actualized leader you are capable of being.
Mentioned in this episode:
Transcript
David Gold: You want to extend your your dream, your individuality, your talents to the full extent that you can. And recognizing that what wants to emerge is bigger than what you can dream up.
Voiceover: You’re listening to The Build a Vibrant Culture podcast with professional speaker, coach and consultant, Nicole Greer.
Nicole Greer: Welcome to the Vibrant Culture podcast. This is Nicole Greer, and they call me the vibrant coach. And I am here today with none other than David Gold. So I don’t have a traditional intro for David today. But I am going to start the spray and David’s gonna finish it. So you got it. You know, I have to have a lot of faith if I’m gonna let David finish my story. But but here’s the story. I was down in Wilmington, North Carolina. I was getting ready to speak the next day for a North Carolina government organization. And I was sitting on the back porch. Unfortunately, we’re at the beach in training, but there are these beautiful rocking chairs. And so my daughter and I are sitting out in the rocking chairs, and we are having a glass of wine and we are laughing and having the best time. And all of a sudden David Gold walks up and I’ll let you finish the story, David.
David: All right. Well, well, first of all, you know, fortunately, we were at the beach. Unfortunately, we were there in a monsoon. And I was down with my beautiful wife Julie and my two stepchildren and I’m looking, you know, one is a teenager, one is 20. I’m looking at the rain and thinking what the heck are we going to do? And then actually, Julie, come, you know, Julie’s over there. And, and I see her talking to these two beautiful women. And I’m waiting for her to finish the conversation so we can continue to what we’re doing. And that conversation is like not finishing.
So I went over to see what all the fuss was about. And there’s a couple things that I noticed right away. I mean, I did notice these two, just really beautiful and charismatic women happen to be mother and daughter. And I I think vibrant’s the right word. There was just such a vibrancy in you individually and collectively. And I just so admired. I didn’t know it was mother and daughter, I thought you would do buds. And just the way they were so easy with each other. And you were just so comfortable with each other and you had your inside jokes. And you know, there just was no, I didn’t feel any of the boundaries that you can have between a mother you know, the kind of what’s not talking about this? And then then I knew that my weekend, I knew why came to the beach in a monsoon. it was the meet you.
Nicole: That’s so great.
David: Yeah. So anyway, that’s just I think that’s the way both of us roll in our lives is, you know, obviously plan what we plan, but then just see what type of opportunities arise. And both of us having such a great love and appreciation for people and opportunities and, you know, serendipitous and synchronistic kind of stuff that here we are.
Nicole: That’s it, that’s it. Yeah. So David and I have kept in touch really, it’s been David who’s been keeping in touch, he’s been so diligent about making sure that we develop our relationships. So first of all, I’m grateful for that. And then second, we start out the podcast every time by talking about leadership, and I’m collecting definitions of leadership. I’m trying to figure out what the right definition is. So David Gold, what is your definition of leadership?
David: Well, I let’s let’s let me back, I’ll probably back into that by just kind of giving you some data points of what I what is emerging, in my own experience as leadership. And I would say, first of all, it, it absolutely stems from being the fullest, most accepting version of yourself. And that one, once you do that, whatever it is that you have to offer, that would may maybe appear as leadership, you know, it’s not like, oh, I’m going to lead this, or I’m going to do that or, but no, what happens is that what when you accept yourself and step fully into who you are, then naturally all that you are starts to emerge.
And then people are attracted to that. And rather than, and also I’ve discovered with that perspective, or with that position, with that confidence, that real natural confidence that comes from that is that you don’t feel like you need to be a leader, you don’t feel like you need to exert, you know, power need to exert, exert superiority, but something very natural occurs out of that. And I would say the second you know, I’ll I’ll give you know, so long as you keep your listeners probably figured out, I used to get trial lawyer. So I can’t do anything in a few words. But the other thing that happens is it brings out the best in others. It’s contagious. That kind of natural leadership that comes from stepping fully into yourself and being comfortable and acceptance of yourself is contagious and others step into that as well.
And then in that there’s kind of a natural hierarchy or natural leadership that emerges that that which you most have to bring to the table in the way that you can only, only you can bring it as yourself that starts to that starts to come out and then others show up as their themselves. And then there’s a very natural leadership with it. So I would say the natural leadership is standing fully in yourself as yourself in the moment, with great curiosity about what’s the highest and best that can emerge in that moment in relationship between two or more people. How’s that?
Nicole: I thought that was great. And the word that’s ringing in my mind is like, well, actually, I have two words ringing in my mind. One is like, bring your authenticity, you know, once you really understand who you are, and what you have to offer, that’s what I think I heard you say. Then that just rings of authenticity, like be yourself. And that, and that draws people to you is kind of what I heard. And then the other thing is, too, is, I believe one of my, one of my philosophies, is, and maybe even a theology is that everybody’s born with, like, a little bit of genius. And everybody’s genius is just like a little bit different. So if you can bring your authentic genius to the party, and you are free to, you know, free and willing to give it to other people, you know, share, you know, share what you do share your talents and skills, then I can’t think of an organization that wouldn’t be tremendously successful if everybody had that mindset.
David: Oh, you nailed it. I mean, we should just stop the podcast. And yeah, it’s like, we went to the back of the book.
Nicole: That’d be too short, Dave.
David: With you and I, and with microphones, and there’ll be a shortage of time, things to talk about. I think what you’re saying is so beautiful, I’m seeing it so much more in my, in my practice, as I’m working with, with really, you know, creative and dynamic people that know they have something to bring out into the world is that, so often what we do is the edges that we have, or that we round off the edges, and we think, oh, this individual is part of myself, that’s so me, people won’t accept that it’s too much for people. I’m sure you and I both hear were too much, or too much or too much.
And in fact, that’s the genius. So what people were doing, too many people, and I would, and again, I think you and I both have the gift of bringing this out in people. You know, seeing it, sensing it and then coaxing it out with great you know, skill and great love, I know you do. Is that we stopped have them stop turning down the dimmer switch on their genius. The fact that which makes them so unique, is in fact, the only knows what they have to bring to the table. And as you know, as we also both know, the greatest value that people get is in transformation. And so that individuated part of themselves, that genius you talk about is the part that actually transforms others.
So not only are they holding keeping their light under a bushel basket to get a little theology in there as well. But they’re also just, they’re dumbing down their true value. And their true abundance because they’re, they’re scared of their genius, they’re scared is going to bring people out. And I know what both of you and what we both do is create a safe space where people can bring their genius out, and really be themselves and start experimenting with themselves and see what that see what that looks like.
Nicole: Yeah. And I think that it gives permission. I think that’s the most important thing is, you know, the minute that I’m unapologetic about who I am, I mean, I have to be a woman of integrity. I’ve got to be a woman of character. I gotta, you know, hit some of the solid principles and morals that we’ve got going on. But the my quirkiness and like you’re saying, like don’t if I don’t round off my edges. I really liked that picture. You know, the quirky, has a lot of quirk. You know, like your hard edges are your best edges, right.
That’s what cuts through the mess and helps you get forward if you got a little sharp edge. I think that’s great. Well, you know, one of the things that I found on your website, at least twice was this quote, and so I want you to talk about this quote, because I think a lot of times in business people are trying to you know, be so linear about things. And you know, so calculated in research and I think all that is very important. Both you and I went did a lot of school. School is important everybody. Go to school, get as much schooling as you can afford.
However, at some point you got to go kind of like with like, your gut or with spirit or courage and you say life cannot give you anything you are not willing to give yourself. And when I when I read that I pondered it for a little while before we got on our call. And it’s almost like you have to believe that you can do whatever you need to do in business. And once you believe that’s like you’re willing to give it to you, is that what you’re talking about there? You got to believe that you can get it done. What are you saying?
David: So that’s a quote, actually is something I heard from Panache Desai, so I want to, I want to footnote that and I’ve made it my own. And I what I find is that people, I don’t know if this is answering exactly you’re coming from but I’ll just, again, give you data points, and we’ll see if we circle around to a thesis here. Is that I from my own life I kept the lid on my I didn’t feel that I deserved, was worthy, was in my destiny, to have a great love and to be really successful and to be known and to achieve something big. Even though I had all this drive and I was doing it you know. I was I built a successful practice right sold companies you know, I had this great effect but all the time I thought oh, well no, that’s not really me. I don’t deserve this. You know deserve amusing deserve very, you know, very generically.
And I see this with every, I just see this everywhere I look. Is that, there’s a way that we disqualify ourselves, everyone that I’ve met so far, almost almost everyone has a reason to disqualify themselves from accepting the abundance and the gifts and the partnership that life offers to us. In every I think I believe in every moment. I know, you know, again, I don’t want to speak for you. But I feel this is something that we share. And one of the reasons that we resonated. If we can suspend our disbelief, one in that we’re worthy of receiving whatever it is that life wants to give us, and two that life actually wants to give it to us. Those are the two things I find people either think, I ain’t worthy, not for me, or if it’s if, you know, if it is for me, life ain’t gonna give it to me. And when and there’s a way that we when we step fully into life into love into opportunity.
And really, again, it’s just stopping the self disqualification, that life starts to give us things and it shows up, that’s an interesting. There’s one of my clients I was speaking to, and she said, you know, the more I evolve, the more I leave people behind. And I thought, well, that is such a mixed message to send to the universe, because you’re basically saying, don’t give me any more transformation, because I’m going to be lonely, right. And I’m sure if you thought about all of your clients, you think everyone’s got something like that. They have some reason that if they take that, if they take a step, it’s not, it’s not going to work for them. And so it’s only when I, I, you know, and for me is, you know, my story, which I say it’s a love story.
You know, after 40 years of spiritual digging, and 40 years of business that I, I found everything that I was looking for, and you know, and that beautiful woman who walked up to you and you started talking to at the beach, brought us together. That once I realized how good life was, and how good life could be and how blessed I was, you know, and I use that word blessed with generically you can put any context you want in it. You know, whether it is some intelligence giving you that or life giving you that or me lucking into it. I don’t know what the hell it was. But whatever it is that once I allowed myself to see that, and I realized, oh, you know, at first I couldn’t believe that she could love me. I can’t, I’m not worthy. I mean, what the hell does she see in me? It’s the same kind of stuff we’re talking about. I was unwilling to give myself the love that was actually in front of me.
And then, and I don’t know if I told you this story, I’m giving you a long answer. But I love to tell this story. Because I tell Julie, if I don’t tell anybody how much I love you in one conversation. I haven’t done her justice. I love justice here. But that when she told me that she loves me for no good reason. Should I love you for good reasons and no good reason. And then I realized, oh, okay, and life loves us for no good, no good reason. And when you realize life loves you for no good reason, then you stop disqualifying yourself, because you think I’m not good enough to have it. And so what I’m finding is, it’s all either you pull that little pin out whatever that self disqualification is, at least have people question it and finally accept themselves and then like themselves and learn to love themselves on that trajectory, then life just starts to give them stuff.
And I’m sure you do this as well. You get people to experiment with that philosophy. You get people just pretend for a week that you’re okay. Pretend for a week, you don’t have to fix yourself, pretend you haven’t done the unforgivable you know, the Harry Potter the three unforgivable curses. You know, pretend that hasn’t happened. And just see what life brings you. And then when life brings you that, then you can step deep, you know, then you say, oh my god, I can trust life a little more. And you trust a little more and life gives you a little more. And before you know it, you’re living the kind of magical lives that you and I are so blessed with and that I got just a little snapshot of, you know, the moment I laid eyes on you and your daughter.
Nicole: Yeah. And I think really, it’s um, you could call it a mindset maybe that might land with the with some of my listeners is, you know, you can have a poverty mindset or you can have an abundance, you know, mindset. And what what Dave and I are talking about is nothing new. You could go back you could watch some read some book or watch the movie The Secret or whatever, you know, and and we could bring some more theology into it, you know. You know, you got to knock on the door so you can get your answer but you got it you gotta knock, you know. So I think that you know, a lot of leaders hold themselves back from greatness because they have a great degree of doubt instead of belief.
So it’s either abundance or poverty, poverty or have or belief or doubt, but there’s there is a mental model in there that is holding you up, and I know that’s what you do. So you know, I said it wasn’t going to give a traditional introduction. But what Dave does is he works with people, with leaders, and he does one on one mentoring. And then he also does a group mentoring model. And in that group mentoring and one on one mentoring, I assume that you would work on this mindset with people that you would help them get in the right way. Do you have a name for the mindset that you try to help people get in place?
David: I don’t know if I have a name for it. I would say that it comes down to something that I, first of all, I wanted to say that what you do and what I do, and again, I’m not just blowing smoke, Nicole, I know that I know, you’re the real deal. And I want everyone listening to know that. Yes, you’re very, you know, you’re very articulate, and you’re, you know, you’re very polished. But you’re also just really authentic and you, you talk from it, not about it. You’re one of those people that talk from it and not about it. I just want to acknowledge that and everyone in your ecosystem to realize how lucky they are to have you in that ecosystem. And what I say, my transformation is I started to love more than I feared.
So I started to trust more than I feared. So the mindset, and that doesn’t mean I’m still not afraid of stuff. And I’m still, you know, because that’s who I am. You know, I’m human. And I was born into this particular high strung, you know, blah, blah, blah, type a kind of guide. And at the same time, um, I think when people get to be 51%, you just got to be 51% trust versus fear. 50% love versus rejection, and get said, so that that is where your center of gravity is. And then once once you kind of cross that divide, and this is, yeah, this is what I do. And we could talk more about how I do it, compare notes and how you do it. I’m sure there’s a lot of similarities. We never compared notes. Is that once people come to that, then there’s a momentum that comes.
There is a there is a momentum where you start to trust more, you start to recognize your fears as being just old wounds old stuff. You know we talk about scarcity. I noticed when I start worrying about money, it’s just because I know if I worry about money, I feel I’m in control. Oh, I’m worried, okay, I’m taking steps. And so now I’m, I’m saying I’m the one in control of it. So I even know, when I go into a scarcity mindset, I’m retracting, I’m going back into oh, I’m the one that’s got to control it. Versus living with this cure, you know, like you say, bring best business practices, you know, that’s the, that’s, again, that’s part of both of our skills. We know the best business practices.
We’re not telling people to, you know, it’s like Reagan said, trust but verify, right. We want to be able to get people to bring that but at the same time, we’re having them extend beyond what they can control, to let life prove its trustworthiness form for them. So that so that abundance and so that opportunities and so that, yeah, just opportunities beyond what you can think of. So I guess if I had to say the mindset, it’s one where, it’s living with an expectation of opportunity and abundance with your eyes wide open.
Nicole: Expectation of opportunity with your eyes wide open. Did I get it right?
David: With eyes wide open. And yeah, the wide open piece is that I think this is part of the knocking at the door is, hey, this is a partnership you’re in. I’m in, I’m in a partnership with the universe. I’m bringing my everything that I’ve learned through, you know, 40, some years, like I say, in law and business and mentoring to the table. And everything that I learned, you know, 30 day isolations, with a cabinet and working for decades with spiritual teachers, I’m just bringing all I’m bringing all that into the picture. And that’s, that’s what we do. And it’s not an either, you can’t spiritually bypass in that.
And that’s what a lot of a lot of people I used to work with mostly spiritual types. And I got very frustrated because they thought because they had had a spiritual experience or experience or because they had this discipline or that discipline that life was going to bring them to them. And maybe for some it did, but that’s not that’s not the autonomy. That’s not the you know, that’s not leadership. That’s basically entitlement. And I don’t want entitled, I want people I mean, we are all entitled, because we’re human, we all deserve everything we get. But at the same time, I want people to say, hey, this is my life.
I want to I want to do something, I want to make something. I want to just manifest the highest, most intense version of myself that I possibly can. And when you get that, plus a real sense of appreciation, and the humility that comes from realizing how big and beautiful the universe is, that’s magic. The magic is full autonomy and full surrender all at the same time. And that’s the magic that we both create the space for that. Maybe I don’t want to again speak for you, but I think there’s probably a parallel in terms of what you do.
Nicole: Right, right. Well, you know, I don’t know I can’t get away from duality, because you just throw out a duality right there. You said it’s full surrender. Full surrender. And what was the opposite? You said full surrender and full.
David: Autonomy. Individuality.
Nicole: Yeah, and here’s what I’m thinking about when I’m listening to you talk is really, you leaders have to have a philosophy. And this is a big part of my keynote that I do. That’s called Get Lit. And the lit, a big part of it is the L. Leaders need to know what they believe. And I think that’s what we’re talking about today is a mindset of belief system. And really one of the major points of my leadership philosophy, my personal leadership philosophy, how I lead myself, how I try to instruct others, is that you have a moral responsibility because you’re on planet Earth. I mean, you’re here.
And so there has to be a reason. And that reason is that you probably have a unique ability, talent, skills, gifts, those rough edges, the quirkiness, whatever we’ve talked about so far. And those are supposed to be put to use. So like almost like the journey is to figure out how do you put those things to use, because there’s probably something you’re supposed to affect on planet Earth while you’re here. And if everybody was on was on mission, as I like to say, then we would get a lot of things cleaned up on planet Earth. But the reason why it’s a hot mess, is because people are doing what you said.
And let me go back and repeat it everybody. Life cannot give you anything you’re not willing to give yourself. So if you’re not willing to give yourself permission to be your best self, your authentic genius, then life is not going to give you the opportunity to exercise it right. Like you can’t, you can’t go play unless you know the rules of the game, right? It’s that duality, surrendering to the fact that oh my god, I have a moral responsibility to get something done. And number two, I’m so grateful and humbled that I get to be part of it, you know, that’s the duality of it all.
David: Yeah, and it’s beautifully said. And interestingly enough, my own experience, you know, as someone who who hungered after unity, and was tired, you know, tired of the either or, which I realized this is the beauty of being alive as you have those dualities. Is that after a while the surrender, and the full exercise of your individuality become one thing. And it’s not, you know, at first, it feels like you’re toggling back and forth, okay, I’m pushing myself, I’m surrendering, I’m pushing, I’m surrendering. And you kind of toggle back and forth. And that’s, that’s cool, you know, but there’s a point where that becomes one thing, where you’re acting with full autonomy.
And at the same time, in this cycle of surrender is a good you know, it’s kind of a good word, but it’s more like, a curiosity about what wants to emerge that doesn’t, what wants to emerge. And then when you because then because as soon as we, you fear something, if you fear something, you try to control it. As soon as you control it, you stop receiving, because you’re saying it has to come like this. I got to be the guy, I got to be the woman I got to be the person is holding all this in. And so there’s a way of just putting your arms down and saying, okay, what, what wants to emerge around the edges that I can’t even dream of. And that’s the kind of the surrender.
So from just the more practical, you know, I know you’re keep bringing me which is great back to practical stuff, relatively, or at least, you know, exercisable stuff stuff people can immediately take into their lives. Is that you want to extend your your dream your individuality, your talents to the full extent that you can, and recognizing that what wants to emerge is bigger than what you can dream of. When you’re at that edge where you are at your edge and you bring everything into it. And at the same time you realize that something bigger wants to emerge that even at you at your edge can figure out, that’s when magic happens. That’s when greatness happens. And that’s when something really new comes into being.
Nicole: Yeah, and you know, that’s really where joy lives. I mean, like, isn’t it amazing that we could create something that never existed before? I mean, that’s so stinking fun, I can’t even tell you. I’ve got a really practical example. So if any of you are listening to this and thinking, well, give me a practical example. I’ll tell you something that happened to me. Just in the last week. I was sitting with a chief marketing officer, and we were talking about sales. And you know, sales is such a funny thing. Because like some people are like natural born salesperson. They just believe that they can go out and talk about this product or service, this organization, and they can get people to believe.
And then there are others that think oh, that’s, I would never want to be a salesperson. I would never want to have enough power over another individual to convince them of anything. Right? There’s just like two camps. It seems like to me. Well, I was talking with this chief marketing officer, and he says, Nicole, I could let it rip with the marketing. But I’m afraid our people couldn’t handle the business. And I was just about to lose my mind on the inside. Now and outside, I remained calm. And I’m like, tell me more about that because I almost didn’t know how to respond because the marketing director’s job is to let the marketing rip, that’s the job. And he’s so worried about the other side of it.
Wouldn’t it be so much fun if the marketing had an effect, people came into the business, and then the business started rising to the occasion, and getting where they need to be. But see, it’s all a domino effect. And so he had the fear that you were talking about, instead of like, the belief that they could get it done. So he’s gonna hold back for now. I’m like, if you want to be completely practical, that’s a terrible business plan, by the way.
David: God, it must drive you nuts. I mean, you might want to think of my shoulders and shake him and say. But here’s the cool things, you know, so one of my, I don’t know. Yeah, maybe you and I get them in a phone booth together, we’ll pull him around. But part of the model, one of my things is whatever showing up in your business is showing up in your life. And I can virtually guarantee that what he’s doing with marketing is how he’s holding back in probably every facet of his life. Okay. And you think about all of us are sending mixed messages to the universe. Like the woman that doesn’t want to evolve, I have a another, you know, it’s funny, he put the basketball hoop in for Ashton for my son here. And we started talking and like almost everyone that comes into my life they become clients. You know, the guy that got the mice out of our crawlspace. He’s a client, you know.
So, anyway, but the point is that I he doesn’t want to grow his business because he didn’t want to have his time away from his family. So he’s in an absolute no win situation. It’s it’s laudatory. That’s nice that he’s doing it. But no, he’s got a he’s got to scale his business and find someone else to do it. But if if we’re reflective, it’s an interesting exercise that I would just invite people to play with is, what am I? What message am I sending out to the universe, it’s actually holding me back, I’m running with the brakes on. Almost everyone that was running, or walking or crawling, but they got the brakes on. And they wonder why they’re not getting what they want.
And a lot of it, you know, back of the book answer is a lot of us are just afraid of being seen. A lot of people who think they want to do something, they’re still because they haven’t gone through the self acceptance, they haven’t really, you know, whatever the process is of really starting to see the perfection of who they are. They’re afraid if someone sees them, they’re going to see that part they don’t want to be seen. But anyway, the larger point which you make, I think, is beautiful, which is that he’s, he’s in a job, he’s working against himself. He’s actually right against himself. And, and that’s so, we all do it.
And we know it because there’s something in our gut, there’s a way we I’m with me, there’s a certain energy that I feel that I know, I’m running with the brakes on. And we get to know ourselves well enough, we said, whatever that is, I’m going to step out of it. You know, I know that I’m going to stop whatever I’m doing. I don’t care what I’m in the middle of, I’m just going to stop it. Because the energy that goes into a thing becomes the thing itself. If I’m coming from a point of fear, if I’m coming from a point of conflict, then I’m going to create fear and conflict. If I’m coming from a point of ease, and trust and love and curiosity, and expectation, then that’s, you know, and that’s why you and I have the lives that we have is because we know ourselves enough, and we know life enough, have enough experience to know that it begins with us.
And where we’re coming from, like the beginning, when you said when we’re leaders in the best possible when we’re leading in the right part of ourselves, that the outcome will be the best possible outcome. And when we’re leading from a position of fear, or ego, or power, or scarcity or whatever, then whatever that outcome is, is not going to be the best possible outcome. It’ll just be a reflection of the energy that we started with, it then becomes what we’ve created as leaders.
Nicole: Yeah, well, you know, I have a methodology, and I know you do too. So let’s compare notes on our methodology. Do you want to do that, because I think that that would be fun. I created a little methodology called the shine coaching methodology, because I’m vibrant, right? Because I also am a marketer. But anyway, so shine, the first part of it is self assessment. And I think a big part of why people don’t lean into their greatness or their uniqueness is because they haven’t stopped to survey, what they got. What they got to bring. And a lot of leaders, I think my experience is, is I work with leaders who are very bright, very intelligent, and they they move up in their career, because they have a lot of good morals. They’re there on time. They work hard, they’re reliable, they’re generous, they’re dependable, all of these wonderful character traits.
So you have to take stock of that, you know, if that’s the way you are, you almost have a blind spot, as I like to say as to how great you are. But the reason they’ve moved up is because they’re technically proficient, they gain in institutional knowledge, which makes them valuable. But when you want to move from that institutional knowledge great guy or gal into greatness, that’s when you have to stop and go, what? What’s great about me? You know, because we were all told, you know, don’t get too big for your britches, you know, you know, don’t get too full of yourself. But if you work with me, I’ll give you permission to talk about how awesome you are. So you get clear. How do you do self awareness? Yeah.
David: So let me let me just reflect on that that step because it’s so similar. And I, I call it the hero’s journey. And so the first I, it’s so, and this is just such a great example of what you lead off with, because we are each bringing our individual history. It’s not like, oh, I’m going to take yours, you can take mine. No we both found a way to express our capacity to transform people in the way that, you know, we live our lives. Okay, so the first thing that that I generally do, and I don’t know whether I attract these people, or whether, you know, everyone’s got this, but I I call it a hero’s journey. Which is that what what is it that your life has been the perfect preparation, and expression and formative process to bring your greatness out? Because most of us think, oh, it’s all haphazard, it’s just happening to me, you know, this happen, I have this regret, I have that regret this regret.
But when someone starts to really feel into what their life is about, and what the purpose, and starts stepping into this higher purpose. This destiny whatever, higher might just be, you know, I’m going to build a better this or that or the other thing, it doesn’t have to be, you know, creating some spiritual system. But what once people step into that their life start to make sense. And then once their life start to make sense then one they stop disqualifying themselves from these things that happen that seem random that we’re all, you know, we’re all regretful about the first bad marriage, the bad investment decision that time we you know, the equivalent we have the dream when we show up naked do our final exam, you know, whatever that embarrassment shameful moment is.
So it’s the same thing. It’s like, okay, we’re gonna recontextualize your life, is truly the hero’s journey that it is. And, you know, when I said, for me, it’s when at 62, you know, Julie came in, I realized, everything that I done that seems so random, and I have regretful was the perfect preparation for me, being the person that I am. So very, very similar. I just contend that and I have people then go back through and, you know, look at three incidents that that happened in your life that you think were just random, regretful, but see how now that you know who you are, and what you’re here to do make perfect sense. And the last thing I’ll say, because I don’t want to want to bounce back and forth, is that this mutually informs each other, that your life informs who you are.
And you say, oh, this happened that helped create me. And when you start to realize who you are, it helps you contextualize these seemingly things. But both again, step in your greatness step past the narrative. Little near and I’m sure you know, you know how to rewrite that you know, how to overwrite narratives. I think that’s one of your superpowers, is you’re really good at helping people overwrite the limited narratives that they have that keep them from stepping fully into their greatness, which is what you see, which is another one of your superpowers, Nicole, I might add, is that you’re able to see greatness before they do in themselves.
Nicole: Yeah, I do see potential in people all the time. I was talking with a woman earlier today. And I told her that she should think about being a model and she’s 48 years old. And she’s like, what are you talking about? And I’m like, there’s a huge market for women over 40 who can model, you could totally be a model. She thought I was nuts. Anyways, we’ll see if she becomes a model. Stay tuned. Because she’s looking for something to do with her life. And she’s gorgeous. And she’s 48. But anyway, so the next part of my methodology is habit work.
And I have a coach, every coach should have a coach or they’re a big hypocrite in my opinion. And that’s a strong opinion. And habit work is, you know, realizing what repetitive things do I do that either either serve me or slay me? Right? So really having a consciousness now, I’m not a big believer in stopping bad habits. I’m a big believer in increasing good ones. Because when you increase good ones, the bad ones go out the back door. I mean, like, it’s really hard to start running and keep smoking, you know? So those kinds of things. So what how do you deal with habit work? Talk to us about habits, because I think leaders need to have amazing set of habits.
David: I first of all, it’s hilarious, because I just told this story a couple of days ago. The way I quit smoking when I was in college, I started jogging. So it’s just funny that you pulled that one out of the air, because that’s what I did. So I don’t know, then I again, I’m gonna go I’m gonna go high and then bring it down. What I discovered was after like I said, four decades of intensely trying to perfect myself and get rid of these things I didn’t like about myself, you know, my self absorption and my fear and all this other stuff that I had is that I found that I was able to love my way past things that I couldn’t, like, force my way through.
And then I found that it was stuff in the rear view mirror, it was now in the rearview mirror that was always in front of me because I’d actually become a different human being. So very practically, I want to identify this kind of stuff that isn’t that you know, is I don’t know if I told you, but you know, I have these three keys to enlightened decision making. And one of them.
Nicole: Tell us, tell us. The three keys to enlightened decision making, because I’m gonna tell you making good decisions is a habit. People make bad decisions over and over and over. So yeah, don’t miss that. Okay, so tell us the three keys.
David: Because it’s a program I’m doing for founders groups, you know, I work with business founders. And anyway, the first question I ask, and the third one is going to answer semi answer the question that you asked. And the first one is, is this mine to do? And so often, it’s like, oh, we act out of obligation. You know, there’s so many things I could do I have to do this. But is this actually mine to do? And I think you and I both found, what’s ours to do. And we’re constantly making that decision. Is this client mine to take on? Is this person’s problem, something this, you know, is this mine to take on? Whatever it is. So this requires, you all these requires self knowledge.
So that’s the first question I ask is, is this mine? When you said, you want to do a podcast, it was mine to do. Boom. You know, other people could ask me to do starting not not so much. The second one is, how does the decision make me feel? And this is really tricky, because this again, it gets the self trust, how much we trust ourselves. Because, you know, it might make me feel really good to you know, someone can make feel, there’s a beautiful woman I’ve been married 20 years, I’ve made me, you know, no, I’m talking about how does it? I run that experiment. I’m sure you do. I run it with clients all the time. You think of like the woman who’s thinking about being a model, sit here and think for a moment, imagine yourself on the runway, imagine yourself in front of a camera. How do you you know, how does it make you feel? So is it mine to do? How does it make me feel?
And the third one was kind of the answer to the habit thing is, what is the most loving decision I can, what is the best loving decision I can make in the next moment. Now, I’m going to say, first of all, I’m a trial, I’ve been a trial lawyer, I started doing that, you know, I’m not, I’m not a Pollyanna kind of, you know, all you need is love kind of person. I, I am very practical, and in many, many ways, but I have found that that is, that is just such a beautiful way to live my life and to attract certain things. But that gets to the habit piece. Because I thought is the next loving choice that I have to light up another cigarette or eat that doughnut, you know, or whatever it is, because it gets back to the self love.
And I thought what happens is that you know, I remember when I started doing hot yoga, they just said, you’re going to find your habits change, because you’re going to get so in tune with what makes your body healthy, you’re just gonna stop doing this stuff that doesn’t do it. Is there a certain amount of willpower? Yes, but it’s the attunement. I would say my approach to habits is yeah, let’s identify and let’s see. And, you know, usually if someone’s got to, you know, just, I don’t want to get into the details of anything, but there are certain habits that they have to take their energy away, that take their self respect away, you know, and they know it. They know they they’re coming to me or coming to you, they know it. They don’t need you to point it out to them.
They need a reason and a way to do it that doesn’t involve all the old voices, you’re just no good, you can’t do it. And the more we are attuned with ourselves, and the more we love ourselves, and we love the people that are affected by these, quote, bad habits, I just find an energetic ability in an overriding rather than a forcing through. And I think and I realize that’s what you’re, I recognize as soon as I met you, I thought, well, you’re really good at overriding some of this stuff, rather than just energizing them to try harder. You want to overwrite the tendency to do something that’s self destructive, because I just care so deeply and just very practically a lot of my quote, bad habits that I’ve never really been able to break, they drive Julie nuts.
And I just don’t want to drive her nuts. And it’s so much more effective to just really want to do it that way. And again, again, sometimes I just have to push myself away from some you know, it doesn’t mean we lose our willpower. It just means it’s such a, I would call it a more enlightened way to start making choices that are healthier for you and for the people you love and for the world that you love.
Nicole: Well, that leads me to the I, which is integrity. Okay, so here’s the thing, if if you have great habits, and you make you use the third question, which is, is you’re going to make the choice based on love. I think you’re going to experience more wholeness in your life. Because what I tell people all the time is people are so confused about integrity, they think they got it. But you know, sometimes you got it sometimes you don’t. You know you’re in and out of integrity with everything you think or say or do and it comes and goes and that and first of all the moment you can wake up and go, oh my god, I better ask myself those three questions Dave Gold was talking about on Nicole Greer’s Vibrant Culture podcast because I need to make sure I’m doing things out of love because we know that like if I put my arms around, you know my daughter, I make her more whole.
If I smack her across the face, I take away part of her. So love is the wholeness recipe. But you know, I think that one thing that people need to recognize is, you know, you’re not a person of integrity every single moment of your life, and you want to strive for that place. And so I think that that’s the place of doing more loving, which is, you know, loving is a character trait. I’m loving, generous, kind, compassionate, you know, that’s the whole humanity piece. But what are your thoughts on integrity, to try to call people into integrity?
David: Well, first of all, is, you know, we get we do it by living the lives that we live and model, and truly modeling and manifesting it. That’s the most important thing, you know, we will find words to transmit our state of being, that we as leaders, and I mean, we it’s everyone listening who’s a leader, we do it by doing it. And I also want to just put a finer point on something too, that we both know, as parents and use your daughter’s example, beautiful daughter. Is that sometimes the most loving choice doesn’t look very loving. It’s firing somebody. It’s saying no, you know, there’s a lot of times that the most loving, I’m going to sit, you know, we’ve been talking off thing, but I’m in a situation right now, where the most loving choice I can make seems very unloving to lots of people.
So the loving choice, and this is where I think the integrity comes from. The integrity as in, I’m not having them tell me what’s the loving choice. I’m not having others. Oh, yeah, I want feedback. And you know, and I’m fortunate to live with, you know, someone who is, holds that standard and holds me, we hold each other to that standard as well. So yeah, it involves others, but it comes from deep within. And there’s something interesting, I didn’t realize it. It was like a duh moment where it was actually a second spiritual teacher I work was talking about, well, integrity means integral. It means one.
Nicole: From integer. Back to algebra, right?
David: Bingo! So it’s not just integrity is I don’t steal, you know, when the collection plate comes out, I put money in instead of taking it out. I mean, that’s, that’s sure. That’s, that’s, that’s integrity. But the other integrity is living in wholeness. You know, what does it mean to live in wholeness, and in consistency, you know, what is actually consistent with the highest part of myself. And this is, this is where it takes real heart and real courage, which, again, I I see and admire in you, is that you can’t set it, I can’t set the rules up in advance.
You know, I can in a way, but every moment is going to reveal itself. What does it mean, and this is the beauty of it seems like a great burden. Like, oh, yesterday I was, you know, I let someone slide when I should, you know, when that couldn’t get fired, today, I have to fire them. I can’t say I always give them a second chance, I can’t say should never give a second chance. Living in wholeness with you, and not just with you, but with the universe, whatever that means, you know, that that’s the enlightened decision making is being so so singularly in touch with yourself. And so singularly a part of the world, or the universe, whatever you want to call it, that you are responding rather than reacting.
Your decision is a response rather than a reaction. And that to me, I have found so much more integrity in that and much and also more confidence, to be able to just withstand the opinions of others or the projected opinions of others who might think that I’m not acting in a particular way. And I want to just add one more thing again, because I, I didn’t come on here, intending to just flatter you so much, but I just am so impressed in the person you are.
Nicole: Well, I’m grateful, I gotta tell you.
David: It’s nice to be seen. You know, you and I spend all our time seeing other people and loving other people and it’s nice to be seen and loved ourselves, right. And I think what we both do, I think where the love really comes in as you and I hold a space of love for the people that we work with. We really hold them in love even, even when we’re holding their feet to the fire. But we’re holding their feet to the fire within a space of love.
Nicole: And I’ll tell you, David, I sometimes I love them and their life more than they do.
David: Of course.
Nicole: And that’s so painful. I’m like why don’t they just. And this brings us to the next part of the methodology, which is a next right step. Why don’t they just take one next right step? I mean, like, it could be so little, so teeny, tiny, but just move in that direction. And I can’t I ask all the right questions. You know, I even get to the point where sometimes I break my International Coaching Federation rules. And I say this is what you need to do. And they don’t do it. It makes me an insane person. But my thing is, is so you know, once you self assess and you get some habits in place, and you realize that you know that’s gonna make whatever you found you had in the self assessment piece, whatever unique ability, talents, skills, whatever your jagged edges that are supposed to be jagged. And you put good habits in place.
And you lead with this love this great character. And even if it means firing somebody and oh my gosh, that’s a whole nother story we’d have we could talk for five hours about firing people. Because so many people are in the wrong spot. And they need to make the next right step, and you could help them. But anyway. So there’s this thing of next right steps. So when you see a clear path for somebody, how do you help them get moving on the path? What do you, what do you do?
David: What do you do? I want you to ask, answer it first, and then I’ll tell you what I do.
Nicole: Well, I just told you, I mean, I ask questions every which way, but loose to see if I can illuminate their thinking by asking this really amazing question, which is what a coach is supposed to do. And sometimes I take the mentor role, right? I put my mentor hat on or my consulting hat on. And I say, okay, listen, this is what you need to do. Do this little baby thing. And oftentimes, it’s just like, research. Like I had a young man that I was working with, he tells me he wants to be, you know, in the C suites some day. He does not have his college degree. Now, I don’t think that matters, overall, like he can get there with or without it, he just has to decide if he’s going to let it be an impediment to your point.
Like, if he’s not willing to give himself the college degree by getting his fanny in school, then he, you know, it will be a forever impediment. If he keeps thinking, oh, I don’t have my degree, I’ll never be in the C suite. But then he has this desire. Again, it’s that yin and that yang. And so I told him, here’s your next right step. Pretty please, before we coach again, will you please go online and figure out how much money it is. What one class would cost you, how it would work into your schedule, I had to like lay it out for him like I was his mother. And I could be his mother. But that’s what I did. Now he’s enrolled. Maybe he just needed a mommy that day.
And I don’t mean that in a bad way. I mean, that in the best, way you need somebody to love you and tell you, this is what you do. And lay it all out. Because honestly, that’s not what we signed up for, for coaching. But if he’s never going to get over that, he needs to know how to do it. And if nobody’s ever told you, and you’ve never had anybody in your life go to college, it seems huge. And it’s just clicking, it’s just clicking around and getting information. And so he so he’s enrolled.
David: Here’s the question. So the question is, is this mine to do? Is it mine to do?
Nicole: Totally mine to do.
David: Yeah, so that’s what I mean. So, so the thing that I found, and maybe you find it too, because I am very bold, as you know. And I just see things, and I just find that sometimes the smallest, you know, whether it’s I’m talking to the cable person, or you know, it doesn’t matter for me, it’s all, you know, I’m always looking, where’s the opportunity? What can I you know, is there a lever? Is there just a little bit of love I can give them a little, you know, whatever, it doesn’t matter. But anyway, the point is, I also realized I don’t, I don’t I don’t want to trespass. So when I’m constantly, you know, in my mind, it’s so ingrained. And I have, you know, I have Julie here, because sometimes I’ll say I just did this, and I did and she said you trespassed. Oh, yeah.
So, so somehow, how do you bring the fullness of your love out into the world, you know, in an uninhibited, uninhibited in a loving and sometimes radical unexpected matter, and still not manner and not trespass. And again, I can’t tell you that I know for me, I’m sure the same thing. This is what this is what you’re what you’re looking for. So I can put so first of all, I asked myself as it mine to do and is it the moment. But there’s a couple things that I do, that are just very helpful, just from tactical. And I think we’re helpful to leaders everywhere. And the first one is like, you know, in sales, we call it the feel felt found. I know how you feel, I felt that way myself, let me tell you what I found.
And so because I’ve lived such a long, and this point it seems like a very long life. You know, to me, this is great. This is my life, you know, this, I say, I’m just this, you want a snapshot, here’s my dogs play in the middle of a podcast. But anyway, a few things, feel felt found. Is there a way of I’m not telling you that. But I’m saying I’ve had this experience, you know, here’s so often I find people that are coming that have, they’re in a relationship, a marriage or whatever, they don’t know whether to get in or out. I don’t want to be doing it, tell them what to do. But I can I can relate my experience of just being in say, you know, here’s, here’s what I found. I didn’t want I didn’t want to leave a marriage because I was afraid of my daughter, my daughter and I was afraid how I would look and I didn’t want to be a quitter.
But then the greatest love in my life was, you know, came out of absolutely nowhere, despite everything I thought I was doing, you know. Sometimes I’m not even gonna tell that story because I might be too you know, but whatever it is, there’s a small thing where you just look and say, what is the experience I had? Just share the experience and let people go. And then the other is that I and this is just my peculiar insanity or, or whatever idiosyncratic. I just tell people, I’m creating universes on a whiteboard and we can erase them in a moment. So then let’s create the universe where you go to college. How does that make you feel? Okay, erase, erase, erase, erase, erase. And so everything is tentative.
And then you just see what sticks where you know, and you again, you’re a master at this, you’re master at feeling the response. You’re mastered feeling the energy that’s coming back out, and being able to say, oh, green light, red light. So to me, it’s, it’s not trespassing. And then when it’s loving deeply, not trespassing. And that’s kind of the seeming duality as well. I want to give but I don’t want to intrude. So it keeps you in that midpoint, that magical midpoint, that magical moment of, you know, period of grace that we all know the flow. It’s another one of these moments that keeps us in flow by holding the trespass and the desire to, to have the best possible outcome.
And then just keeping things light, in terms of the suggestions so that it doesn’t come across, you don’t. And that’s also we don’t want to be mommy. We don’t want to, I don’t want to be daddy, I don’t want to be mommy I don’t want to be, I don’t want to be, I don’t want to be the crutch, that they’re leaning on. My job in the years, I want to, I want to work myself out of a job as quickly as I can, with every one of my clients.
Nicole: I will tell you the thing that keeps me safe, the trust. And this is one of the best things, everybody write this down. If you’re still listening. Here’s what I want, here’s what I want you to do, is I want you to get in the habit, we’re back to H. I want you to get in the habit of asking permission. So one of the best things I ever got taught in coaching school was you know, because there are rules of coaching or guidelines or principles or whatever word you want to put there. Is if you have an idea, or you want to instruct your client, is you say, may I tell you something?
So I’m not gonna ask anymore, I’m gonna start telling. And so I have a very good habit of that. And so, you know, I stepped in and I was the adult in his life I don’t think he had ever had. Right, right, because he didn’t have people that went to school. And so they didn’t know how to tell him to go to school. And so I said, this is how you go to school. It is not complicated, you know? So I, you know, and I kinda liked honestly, David, I love being this mommy for a while. My children left the house.
David: I just feel like you and that mode was like a please, Briar Rabbit. Don’t throw me. Whatever the radish patch. Like, you had to be dragged kicking and screaming. No, you’ve been waiting. You got to dust off that mommy, that mommy mode, you got to use it again.
Nicole: I did and it was so wonderful, but anyway. Alright, last thing, and then we have to go because we’re way over time. But so the last thing we’ve been talking about this whole time. This whole time we’ve been talking about it, but we haven’t labeled it. So the last part of my methodology is energy. And here’s what I know. I mean, like, I don’t I don’t have any research but I bet you there’s a ton of research on it. But like, if you put out good energy, you usually usually let’s let’s make sure we stick usually in there get good energy back. There are forces of evil out there that are just plain evil, mean nasty people, they’re out there. But normally 87% of the time, I don’t know how much percent.
But if I put out good energy, I usually get good energy back. So you have to be so conscientious of putting out good energy. And I think leaders have to really get their head wrapped around that. You know, I’ll ask people, David, I’ll ask a bunch of leaders I’m like, are you allowed to have a bad day? And they go, oh, of course, I am. And I say no, you’re not. And they’re like, get very upset with me. And I say now if you’re having a bad day, because you will have them you have to leave the building. You have to get out of there. Get yourself in a good mood and then come back. Because you set the tone.
That’s what makes a culture vibrant is there is a healthy self assess, habit, a good habit, high integrity, I know what our next right step is. And I’m putting out good energy that’s what gets any organization, a family, whatever, a relationship moving forward. So what, talk about energy and then we’ll wrap it up David. We can talk about energy for five hours. But anyway.
David: The first point is that you need to be literally it’s where you’re coming from. It’s truly being aligned with the best energy within yourself. The best parts of yourself. What that is, and I’ve been running this I’ve been I think I mentioned when we first met at the beach, is I’ve been running this experiment is as much of a marketer as I am like you and everything else is although I you know, my websites up because I’m gonna start going out but basically, I’m just thinking, let’s see if I can attract the right people. Let’s just see if I can attract the right people. And then also say no to the wrong people. Okay, so I’ve been running that experiment, and it’s been going really, really well. Every one of my clients right now is someone that that I none of them that I that I market to they’re all either referrals or they came into my life. Okay.
So one, I’m running that experiment, I don’t know what the data says, but I’m running that experiment, it’s working really, really well. And I would go back to a line that I just inserted somewhere else, about the energy of the thing that goes into a thing becomes the thing itself. And if you’re a leader, whatever energy you’re bringing, that is the product. You know, you think the means are going to justify, and maybe they will, in some ways, but I’m telling you over the long haul. And so for me, you know, I’m driven, I have, you know, like I say, I’m type A and I have things like to do. And I, you know, it’s part of my success and part of my craziness all at the same time.
But what I’ve discovered is when I am just working, I would call it neurotically, for lack of a better word, I stop. I stop. You know, sometimes there’s a deadline, I’m telling you, I’m so this is a work in progress. But I am so trusting of this, that it even sometimes, you know, like, my computer will crash or, you know, I’ll spend 10 times trying to get a video out, I’m saying, okay, the universe is telling me, I want the right energy. And that’s, that’s flow as part of, again, what your talent is. But to me, it’s coming from the right place yourself, and having the courage to realign your energy before you take it out into the world. To the extent that life permits you to do it. You know, when you’re, when you’re in front of the board, when you’re leading the board, the board of directors, they’re not looking over your numbers, you can’t say, you know, I’m having a bad day, come back tomorrow.
You’re gonna have to deliver whatever you’re gonna have to deliver. And there’s a way that it just becomes foundational. And for me, the foundational piece is just energetically starting and reconnecting. And just building this into my life. And watching the kind of people like you that when you go down to the beach and looks like what the hell am I doing here? That’s something emerges. And then this is a part of it. And this is the way that I live my life. And what’s the way that I want everyone to live their lives.
Nicole: Yeah. That’s awesome. Alright. Well, I have thoroughly enjoyed being with you today. I hope the leaders got a little bit from today, you picked up an oldie but a goodie. Feel, felt, found. You got the three ways to make a good decision today. We talked about our methodologies. So hopefully you leaders got something great today. Here’s what you need to do, though. You need to go over to www.Davidgold right?
David: Just Dave Gold.
Nicole: Okay, right. Let’s get it right. All right, davegold.com. Do I have it correct?
David: Yeah, just me, my name, but it’s the informal Dave not the formal David.
Nicole: Okay. All right. He’s, you know, he’s laid back now. Alright, so davegold.com. Check him out. He’s working with leaders and executives to help them get get, get out of their own way and live, what I would call a vibrant life. So it’s been a delight to have you on the podcast today. And listen, I know you won’t be a stranger. So we will be hanging out soon. I’ll talk to you soon and give my love to your peeps.
David: Same to you and your daughter as well. Thanks.
Voiceover: Ready to build your vibrant culture? Bring Nicole Greer to speak to your leadership team, conference or organization to help them with her strategies, systems and smarts to increase clarity, accountability, energy and results. Your organization will get lit from within. Email Nicole@nicolegreer.com. And be sure to check out Nicole’s TEDx talk at nicolegreer.com.
